tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post2606713772484140887..comments2024-02-19T07:24:42.397-08:00Comments on Anglican Curmudgeon: Changing the Constitution: Final Approval in 1901A. S. Haleyhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/05108498446058643166noreply@blogger.comBlogger6125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-79658310438127869562010-11-19T07:19:30.514-08:002010-11-19T07:19:30.514-08:00Mr. Haley, Good point. The dioceses are being led ...Mr. Haley, Good point. The dioceses are being led like sheep and to what end? Well, at least some of the sheep have a brain and are willing to sound a warning. BAAAAAAAH!Alexihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09222877183938209659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-63986650846428252972010-11-18T12:05:25.681-08:002010-11-18T12:05:25.681-08:00UP and Alexi, the dioceses are being led like shee...UP and Alexi, the dioceses are being led like sheep into adopting the new disciplinary canons -- the committee which drafted the changes has even provided them with model draft canons to implement the new provisions!<br /><br />Thus far, only the Diocese of South Carolina has seen fit to resist this unconstitutional trend.<br /><br />As a result, any proceedings taken under the new canons will be null and void, but the Disciplinary Boards handling them will not, of course, take that view. The clergy subject to such proceedings will have just one shot at an appeal to the Provincial Court of Review (3 bishops, 2 clergy and 2 laity) to convince them that the proceedings are unconstitutional. Since, however, the 4 clergy and lay members of the Court are picked from persons already serving on the Disciplinary Boards of their respective dioceses, it is a foregone conclusion what a majority of that Court will decide on the question. Only Dioceses as a whole will be successful in resisting these changes -- individuals will not stand a chance.A. S. Haleyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05108498446058643166noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-18679707798747538942010-11-18T10:16:34.672-08:002010-11-18T10:16:34.672-08:00UP, If that were to happen and the clergy person w...UP, If that were to happen and the clergy person were to point the unconstitutionality of the Canon, it could be quite difficult to proceed esp if this person had a good lawyer versed in canon law AND IF those in charge of the process agreed to the unconstitutionality of the canons. It should matter but I suspect that the unconstitutionality of these canons won't matter a bit to those in charge of the process who want them and the "trial" would proceed a pace to its end. Alas.... sigh.Alexihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09222877183938209659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-74264949540047430132010-11-18T08:21:05.878-08:002010-11-18T08:21:05.878-08:00So why do whole dioceses accept the changes in Tit...So why do whole dioceses accept the changes in Title IV? (Upper SC voted yes in October of this year, and I would bet that 99% of the lay delegates did not understand a thing about the changes).<br /><br />What might happen when a clergy member is tried under the disciplinary canons, and in his defense points out the unconstitutionality of the canon?Undergroundpewsterhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10182191422663119484noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-57761310712801985492010-11-17T14:24:32.449-08:002010-11-17T14:24:32.449-08:00WOW! Strong stuff. If only people would read and ...WOW! Strong stuff. If only people would read and try to understand the guiding principles our national church. I especially liked the last paragraph.Alexihttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09222877183938209659noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-759178030677978044.post-79246950032940661322010-11-17T12:28:06.513-08:002010-11-17T12:28:06.513-08:00This is an excellent series and I definitely recom...This is an excellent series and I definitely recommend it to those who have not yet read it. It draws attention to the principles that underlie the early constitutions of the then Protestant Episcopal Church, principles that form a vital part of the North American Anglican heritage and are definitely worth preserving, not only in the Episcopal Church but also the fledgling Anglican Church in North America and in other North American Anglican bodies. <br /><br />We live in a time when church leaders are tempted for a variety of reasons to centralize power in the hands of a few, to dispense with constitutionalism and the rule of law, and to establish authoritarian ecclesiastical regimes. Abuse of power, arbitrariness in church governance, episcopal tyranny, and prelacy are not synonymous with Anglicanism at its best. They create worser problems than they resolve.Robin G. Jordanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/09511384478845569163noreply@blogger.com